Red Tails...

[ram04]

With you all the way, Red Tails was'nt a bad movie, but a sequel, would'nt be the best.

Theres still alot of WWII stories out there, let them be told.

[sdcc73]

What would the prequel be?

Movie's lead role, officer A.J. Bullard (Terrence Howard) may be a homage to E.J. Bullard of the WW1 Layfeyette Escadrille's lone black pilot. Coinciding the Red Tails prequel to the 100th anniversary of WW1, will most definitely work well, in 2 to 6 years (the 4-year-span of the 100th Anniversary WW1, 2014-2018). Prequel can center on both factual E.J. Bullard + fictional A.J. Bullard. A.J. a child hearing + seeing all the early struggles of distant uncle E.J. in WW1. Its a great excuse to see WW1 dogfights on big screen (hopefully better than Flyboys). Its also TWICE an excuse to finally unleash WW1 planes in 1:18 scale = 100th anniversary + Red Tails prequel.

SPAD VII of E.J. Bullard: "Tout le sang qui coule Rouge," translation, "All blood is Red."

[cjg476]

I for one wouldnt complain about what war it was. I would love to just see more made. Its sad its hard to find a good movie anymore.

[Dauntless]

I sure would like to see a story done of the Black Knight Eric Hartmann. He's got quite an interesting history besides just being the ace of aces, even post war. My impression, though he was a warrior he was honorable and principled.

There's enough flying Bf-109's around now these days. Might have to round up some Soviet aircraft though.

Though popular history and movies tend to demonize the Axis pilots, they were just caught up in a war like the rest.

There have been good movies done however with WWI German pilots like The Blue Max and Red Baron, but nothing on the WWII ones.

Both Flyboys and Redtails had some stereotypical pilots like Scar and the Black Falcon, the latter pure evil. Though Scar wasn't portrayed that bad except the fact he couldn't believe he was dealing with "Afrikan" pilots, just like the Americans were surprised, so that evened out.

[Jnewboy]

I would also love a movie on Hartmann, or Rudel for that matter...

I went to see redtails finally, It was cool, the special effects were cool, wish they had spent alittle more time making the 109s and 262s correct and not a bunch of yellow crap on the 262s or 2nd SS panzer bages on the 109s... I like the Memphis Bell movie as they used real B17s, The CG B-17s look good, just not totally real, but I dont expect them to blow up real B-17s..

Highlights of the movie that had me rolling my eyes.....

#1 A single Mustang with no bomb blows up a German Destroyer....

#2 A mustang goes head to head with a 262... blows up the 262 and the mustang pilots gets "hit"... no if he got "hit" by a 30mm round he would be all over inside the cockpit

#3 While escaping from prison the guy black guy gets in the tunnel and the white guy says "at least they wont see you in the dark"

#4 the groups first combat sortie against other German planes has them shooting down 109Gs in their P-40s like its a turkey shoot without losing a plane...

All in all I really could not tell if I was watching a serious war movie or a comic book type over the top comedy type movie like 1941. I would have liked it to stay in one mode or the other, Im all for comic relief but dont mix a real war story with a unrealistic comedy.

[Dauntless]

They could call it "The Blonde Knight" of course.

I noticed a few things you mentioned too.

I thought the "at least they won't see you in the dark" was kind of a politically incorrect but funny remark. At least the black director can take a joke like that and put it in there.

I thought that the P-40's going up against the 109G's was unlikely, and they should have been F's or E's right? Though I read at one time the Airmen flew P-40F's also, which were Packard Merlin powered and better performance than the old P-40E's. Not so "hand me down" after all. Then I took into consideration that the P-40 was a plane you didn't want to try and out turn as it was one of the best, even against a Zero. Still dunno about that part. Though they did in actuality score some victories in their P-40's.

Going head on with the Me-262 or even shooting down that many was glorified fiction at it's best. I knew just one shell from a 30mm would be the end of a P-51 like you say.

It was comic book like fer sure.

[EnemyAce]

I think a lot of people forget that they are trying to make a highlight film of a unit's 2 year history into a 2 hour movie. The attack on the ground base is based on the Red Tails' attack on Pantelleria. The Pantelleria attack was the first time an air-only attack forced a ground garrison to surrender. The destruction of the destroyer is based on the attack by the Red Tails on an Italian destroyer the Germans had taken over. They did so much damage that the ship had to be scuttled. The Red Tails did provide air cover for the Anzio landings, didn't take a loss, and did shoot down German fighters. I don't know if they were Fs or Gs, but the Red Tails were in P-40s. The Red Tails also drove off 262s' on the March 24, 1945 bombing mission to Berlin, which was the longest bombing mission escort of the war. They also set the record for shooting down 5 confirmed German fighter kills in under 4 minutes.

I thought the "can't see you in the dark" joke was a perfect example of the pervasive racism in the 1940s. Even when a white guy is trying to be friendly, they could still be insensitive and insulting.

I don't think seeing the hero splattered all around the cockpit from a cannon round would make for very good cinema. He did die from it.

[gburch]

I think a lot of people forget that they are trying to make a highlight film of a unit's 2 year history into a 2 hour movie. The attack on the ground base is based on the Red Tails' attack on Pantelleria. The Pantelleria attack was the first time an air-only attack forced a ground garrison to surrender. The destruction of the destroyer is based on the attack by the Red Tails on an Italian destroyer the Germans had taken over. They did so much damage that the ship had to be scuttled. The Red Tails did provide air cover for the Anzio landings, didn't take a loss, and did shoot down German fighters. I don't know if they were Fs or Gs, but the Red Tails were in P-40s. The Red Tails also drove off 262s' on the March 24, 1945 bombing mission to Berlin, which was the longest bombing mission escort of the war. They also set the record for shooting down 5 confirmed German fighter kills in under 4 minutes.

I thought the "can't see you in the dark" joke was a perfect example of the pervasive racism in the 1940s. Even when a white guy is trying to be friendly, they could still be insensitive and insulting.

I don't think seeing the hero splattered all around the cockpit from a cannon round would make for very good cinema. He did die from it.

All good points. All through the film, I was spotting the real, historical events you mention, and noting how they had been "zoomed up" a little for the movie -- none of which really bothered me, since my expectations were for a gung-ho, old-fashion, hero/action flick. I didn't go in expecting a documentary, and I wasn't disappointed.

The more I think about this movie in hindsight, the more happy I am with the choices that were made to try to appeal to as wide an audience as possible. They weren't making this movie for me, WWII aviation geek; they were making it for folks who knew little or nothing about the subject.

[Dauntless]

Guess I should check the facts.

Apparently a FW-190 was the first Airmen victory, shot down in a P-40. Doesn't say which P-40 though. I would think it would be the P-40F Packard Merlin though as a FW-190 is a formidable foe.
Most of the combat in the early days were with FW-190's and they continued to encounter them.

According to this article they did encounter the ME-262 and shot down three in that one mission over Berlin, so the film is somewhat accurate. That is quite a feat.
I was always led to believe that only one was shot down during landing, but not so. This was full on combat.
http://www.af.mil/shared/media/document ... 07-059.pdf

[EnemyAce]

That unit received the presidential citation & over 1000 individual medals for a reason. The 1940s weren't exactly a "PC" era, and a lot of very important and powerful people were against them. They were highly educated, highly trained, and fought with a chip on their shoulder. Certainly one of the better fighter units of the war. They deserve the "John Wayne" hero treatment as much as anyone else.

[PanzerArm]

I would also love a movie on Hartmann, or Rudel for that matter...

I went to see redtails finally, It was cool, the special effects were cool, wish they had spent alittle more time making the 109s and 262s correct and not a bunch of yellow crap on the 262s or 2nd SS panzer bages on the 109s... I like the Memphis Bell movie as they used real B17s, The CG B-17s look good, just not totally real, but I dont expect them to blow up real B-17s..

Highlights of the movie that had me rolling my eyes.....

#1 A single Mustang with no bomb blows up a German Destroyer....

#2 A mustang goes head to head with a 262... blows up the 262 and the mustang pilots gets "hit"... no if he got "hit" by a 30mm round he would be all over inside the cockpit

#3 While escaping from prison the guy black guy gets in the tunnel and the white guy says "at least they wont see you in the dark"

#4 the groups first combat sortie against other German planes has them shooting down 109Gs in their P-40s like its a turkey shoot without losing a plane...

All in all I really could not tell if I was watching a serious war movie or a comic book type over the top comedy type movie like 1941. I would have liked it to stay in one mode or the other, Im all for comic relief but dont mix a real war story with a unrealistic comedy.

I don't think you'll never see a movie about Rudel. It would be unmarketable as he was an ardent Nazi.

I finally saw the movie yesterday and I liked it. Didn't love it, but liked it.


-Kevin

[Tanker85]

I saw this same plane at Wal-Mart yesterday, price point was $9.96. Much cheaper then this ebay price.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VHTF-Red-Tails- ... 43acfc63ee
If your into 1/48 scale it looks like a good buy.

Eric

[[CAT]CplSlade]

But they ARE hard to find. The seller did an internet search so it must be true.

[Tanker85]

I didn't read the description, they must be uber rare, since I have the only Wal-Mart in America in my neighborhood. I suppose I should go buy all 6 that are in stock and put them away for safe keeping?